How to Balance Natural vs. Conventional Options for Your Dog
Hello everyone this is Krista with Episode #176 on the Wag Out Loud pawdcast. As much as we sometimes want to hug a dog, animal psychologists say that dogs can be stressed and unhappy when they're hugged. And it's because they see having a limb thrown over them as a sign of dominance. They'll show that stress by licking their lips, looking away, or folding their ears. So maybe go for a belly rub or a butt scratch over a hug whenever you want to show your dog some love.
Welcome to the Wag Out Loud pawdcast, where we are obsessed with bringing you helpful tips on canine health care, nutrition, and overall wellbeing. If you'd like to support the show, check out the amazing online events, products and resources that I personally recommend on the Wag Out Loud website. I'm your host, Krista and I'm super excited to be bringing you yet another tail wagging episode.
Karen Pedersen is a content writer and passionate dog owner from Minneapolis, Minnesota, where she lives with her husband Scott, dogs Tico and Taco, and Cocoa the cat. She has been involved in dog rescue since 2005 and has a soft spot for fostering dogs who need surgery or have other medical issues. She is currently learning more than she ever wanted to about dog reactivity in order to help one of her rescue dogs, Tico, and has made slow but sure progress and is so proud of him! In her spare time, she travels to visit her four grown children and drags her husband out to the Rocky Mountains to hike and try out the local breweries.
Hello, dog lovers! I am so glad that you're here to learn about how to balance natural versus conventional options for your dog. And to cover this topic today, I have Karen Pedersen. Karen, thank you so much for being on the show.
Thank you very much for having me. I'm just excited to be a part of it.
Let's start this conversation. Well, why don't you introduce yourself and tell us why you wanted to cover this topic of natural versus conventional options?
Sure. Well, as you said, my name is Karen and I am a dog lover since I can remember. I’ve got two dogs right now, I have fostered many, many, many dogs over the years. And it just took me on this journey of learning about different options for treating medical issues or behavioral issues. And I eventually started a blog about it because it was hard to find information. And, you know, I wanted more community where we can share different things that work that aren't just the straight out of the textbook answer for something you might be dealing with with your dog.
Right? Well, when you say so much information, I think that is the problem with the internet these days is that you have so many differing opinions. How is the dog parent supposed to know what is best for my dog? Because it is just overwhelming.
So Much Info Out There
It really is. It's overwhelming. And depending on where you are in your dog owning journey, you know, are you at the beginning where you think everything you read must be true and you need to do it? Or have you reached that stage in life where you're like, oh, there's different ways I can do this. They're all okay. And I need to find a way that works for me and works for my dog.
Exactly. Well, and that's exactly what we talk about here is we have to be our dogs’ advocates when it comes to their health and wellness. Absolutely. Well, why don't we start? How would you define natural pet ownership?
What is Natural Dog Ownership?
You know, I think natural pet ownership, it can mean so many things. It might be your approach to medical issues. You might be someone who tries a food change or supplement or acupuncture, instead of just going straight for a prescription medication for a medical issue. It could be your approach to training and behavior. Maybe you use things like decompression walks, or mentally stimulating toys or calling supplements. If your dog is reactive, and you're trying to work with that behavior, it could be your food choices. Some people want to feed their dogs home cooked meals or raw diets. Others want to buy kibble at the store. So it's just this combination of so many things, and it's really different and unique for every dog owner.
Right? I think a lot of people when I speak with them, you know, how did you get turned on to holistic or integrative approaches to Canine care. A lot of times their dogs have an issue that conventional medicine couldn't fix or treat. And the pet parent just gets so frustrated and says okay, I'm at the end of my rope. I want to try natural. Let's go! Do you agree with that?
I think you're right. I think many times you start your journey because your your animal has an issue. For me, you know I'm I was in my 20s I had my first dog and when she turned nine suddenly she started having cluster seizures. So I'm kind of an information maniac so I started reading everything I could find about what can cause seizures. And I stumbled on this article by Dr. Jean Dodds, out in California about the connection between thyroid levels and seizures in dogs. And so I talked to my vet who was conventional. And he said, Well, we can just run a thyroid test here. And I had my first experience in advocating for my pet. And I said, What I'd really like to do is have you do the blood draw, and I'd like to send it to Dr. Dodds’ BloodBank Hemopet out in California. And it was eye opening, because she turned out to be on the low end of normal. So at my vet, they would have said, Nope, she's normal. That's not the issue. But at Hemopet, they do a more intensive thyroid panel, and they take in to account the breed and age. And so Dr. Dodds said, No, this low end of normal for her age, and her breed could actually be the cause. So she started her on seizure medications, which my vet was totally on board with switch, we switched to a raw diet, and her seizures decreased dramatically, we got two more quality years of life with her. So for me, it was very eye opening, because then I realized, you know, every vet’s gonna have a different opinion. And you kind of have to find your own path for your pet and your person. And you have to educate yourself, and then choose the approach that works for you. Don't just believe everything you read or everything you hear.
Yep, I totally agree. Well, it's funny. Well, it's not funny, this is not a good situation when your dog has seizures. But I can totally relate because I was one of the pet parents that just didn't know any different. I was feeding kibble, my dog out of the blue started having seizures, three different vets could not figure out the cause. And at the same time, we were getting a second dog and she was already an adult. And the breeder said, we are not going to sell her to you unless you promise to feed raw, like, Oh, she's gonna eat raw. And Higgins might as well eat raw as well. And wouldn’t you know it, within I know, it was like, three, five days, no more seizures ever. It was one change to a raw, natural species appropriate diet that did the trick. And that was the start of my journey. So you and I have a lot in common. Karen, do you believe that conventional veterinary medicine does have its place?
Does Conventional Veterinary Medicine Have It’s Place?
Oh, absolutely. I mean, I've been very lucky, I live in a city where I have access to holistic vets. But I have my conventional vet that I've seen for a long time. And he is very open. So you know it always every vet is specific, you can have a holistic vet that you don't click with. But he will help me weigh options sometimes. And I might go see a holistic specialist. And then my vet and I will discuss, you know, should we do this? Or should we do that? I remember one instance where I had a foster dog with a horrible staph infection on his skin and the conventional vet diagnosed it and he said, You know, I want to put him on maybe 18 days of steroids. And I was like, oh, you know, they're so bad for the dog. He's going to be drinking and peeing everywhere. You know, do we have any other options here? And he said, You know, when you have a staph infection this severe, I just don't see a way you're going to get rid of it. Without steroids. He said, Now, maybe we could just do 12 days or, you know, a lower number of days. And if we see a turnaround, we could try stopping there. And I'm like, Okay, that seems reasonable. Because this was a dog who was a senior, he had years of horrible care. So I knew that this was a deeply embedded problem, that we might need conventional, to get us to a point where we could start to use more natural and holistic methods to heal his immune system and start to, you know, start to really work at the root issues. So I do think you have to find a balance. And none of us want our dogs to be miserable. And none of us have unlimited financial resources. There's just so many things that play into it.
Yeah, you're absolutely right. Well, my story recently, our dog Winston got sick. Back in November right around Thanksgiving, didn't know what it was. He was already almost 14. They said it could be auto immune, it could be cancer. And we just didn't want to do the invasive diagnostic testing. And I am so much about holistic, let's do holistic, but I was faced with he is really sick, his red blood cell count his platelets just crashed. We had to have the help of an internal medicine conventional doctor, keep him alive for a couple more months. And to this day he passed late January, and we still don't know what it was. But we got two more months with him because of prednisone, which is an unbelievable drug in the right instance. So I'm with you there. And you know, what if my dog breaks their leg or needs surgery, yes, conventional medicine all day long. But if there is a way to seek a natural approach, I and many more of us are figuring out wow, there are ways to treat ticks and fleas without harsh chemicals. Or do I really have to give that heartworm medication for the what if my dog even gets heartworm and the vaccines? And it's it's a balance, and I'm totally on board with you. And, you know, I think at this point, in the conversation, we're talking about how we, as advocates for our dogs sometimes have to struggle between choosing between the natural versus the conventional, and to your point, both medical and behavioral issues. So what are some of the things that we might encounter when we're trying to decide?
What to Think About
You know, there are a number of things. And can I just first say, I'm so sorry for your loss. I love his little voice on your podcast, how wonderful that you got two more months for him not to suffer and just be loved. Yes. Oh, that's wonderful. And to your question, you know, there's, there's a number of different struggles, you might encounter one, you may have a vet who disagrees with you. And sometimes in the case of my vet, we can have a really respectful conversation. And we're both okay, that we have different opinions. In other cases, you might need to change vets. So I've had that happen. I got scolded once by a vet, because I chose not to give my dog another rabies vaccination, and was asking about titers. And for me, it was the first time I'd seen that, vet and I was like, Yeah, we're not a good fit. Other struggles, it can be the expense. holistic treatment and medicine can be more expensive. And that isn't to say, it's not worth that money, and that those vets don't, you know, justify that cost. But we all have to make financial choices, and there's not a right or a wrong choice. There can be, you know, sometimes a natural approach can take longer, because you have to look for the root issue, you know, you're not just putting a bandaid on the symptoms, and natural methods have a slower response. And so sometimes the success or the failure of trying natural is going to hinge on, how long has that problem existed. If I have my one year old dog, and I see he's starting to itch a little more, right away, I'm like, Okay, I need to give him supplements to support his immune system. Maybe he has some spring sensitivities or food sensitivity, I can start working on that stuff. And I'll probably have pretty good luck because it hasn't had time to really grow and get worse and worse. Versus the dog I mentioned this Foster, who was 10 had had horrible allergies his whole life, you know, his ears had lumps from shaking and itching. This is something where his immune system has been struggling for a long time. And that meant that a natural approach was going to take much longer. So so many of these things, you know, they can be a struggle when you have to weigh and balance.
Yep, I absolutely agree. Well, Karen, we are at a point where we are going to take a quick break and listen to our sponsor of the month and then we will be right back. So hold tight everybody.
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And we are back with Karen Pedersen. And we were talking about how to choose and making that decision between conventional options for your dog versus natural. And Karen, I love what you said about the struggles that many of us go through. And I almost define it at times desperation to get an answer. Because it's an emotional decision. These dogs are our family and we can't see them suffer. We want to help them. What is it that we're going to do to help them and I know I have been somebody that it was in that desperate situation? And just, you know, let's try this supplement? No, let's try this one. And I mean, I've had supplement graveyards of just stuff. Yeah, it is a hard choice to make. So why do you love more natural approaches when it comes to your dog?
Benefits of a Natural Approach
You know, there are so many reasons. One is just the empowerment. Because for me, personally, natural health involves being an educated owner, really, you know, thinking through and educating myself when I'm making decisions versus listening and doing what I'm told. Another thing I love is when you're when you take a natural approach, a lot of times it's kind of forcing you to think outside the box. Because you're you're not just looking at this behavioral issue or that medical issue. You're looking at, what is the bigger picture? That is all you know the root that is causing that issue? Like one example I have a dog named Tico. He has been my growth dog he is we think part Border Collie part German Shepherd. He is the snuggliest, sweetest dog I've ever had. But he is fear reactive. And in the course of he's now eight and in the course of his life, I have not just learned about natural health which might mean I do titers for distemper for him and for rabies so that I’m not over vaccinating. Rabies is a little tougher when you have a reactive dog. So then I have to weigh. If someone you know if someone ran up and scared him and he nipped them, okay, I'm legally responsible here. So all these things are factoring in but also what I found with Tico was that food affected his behavior. So as a natural pet owner, I would have days he was great. And days, he was so amped up, he would start hurting the cat and hurting dogs. And those were kind of my signals that if I go on a walk, he's gonna go nuts if he sees another dog. And so I started a log, and I would keep track of what days he was great and what days he had a real hard time staying calm. And I was logging food changes. And I was working with a Chinese medicine practitioner and she said, let's add oatmeal because that's a cooling food. So I thought that's easy enough. I added oatmeal to his raw diet. And within I want to say two days, I started to notice he was really amped up. And by three days or four days, he started to go at one of my other dogs. And it got to a point where that dog would walk in a room and Tiko would run out him and muzzle punch him. And I remember sitting on the floor and crying to my husband saying, I can’t do this, you know, thinking what am I going to do? And as I filled out my log that night, I thought the only thing in our lives that has changed is the oatmeal, but that would make no sense. But I thought well, you know what the heck. So I stopped the oatmeal and within two days I think he stopped going at my other dog and within In about five to seven days, all of his amped up behavior had disappeared. Amazing. And had I not had this natural approach of like, let's look at everything, let's really think about things, I would never, never have discovered that. Well, with that same dog, another aha moment. I don't know if you've ever had a reactive dog. But as a reactive dog parent, you you are always looking for that magical solution, because the internet is full of my dog was doing all these horrible things, and then they changed this one little thing and all the problems went away. And as much as you know, you know, it's not that easy. You hope. And with Tico, part of that journey for me was trying different forms of training. And there's a lot of positive forms of training, they're all really good, they're all different. And with really minimal luck, you know, I made small strides. But, you know, if he goes nuts with a dog that's 50 yards away versus 100 yards away. It hasn't changed my life too much as an owner. And then I stumbled on a trainer. And his approach was that some dogs are fearful reactive, because there are little things you do as a dog owner, that show your dog that you're the guardian. And I'm not talking like Cesar pack leadership, alpha roling any of that. But I'm talking about kind of, if you think human being the consistent parent and little things that dogs look at, such as Do I say hi, right, when I come in the door? Or do I wait five minutes, and then call them over to me to have our wonderful greeting. And that discovery, I have made more progress in the last year than I did in the first seven. Wow. So again, to me, this is in this bubble of natural pet ownership. Looking at all the things that might be adding up to cause this problem behavioral or medical.
Well, I think you just hit the nail on the head, holistic approach is whole body. That's everything. So I love that approach. As you said in the beginning, you know, a lot of conventional medicine unfortunately, puts a bandaid on things that our dogs are facing. Whereas holistic, might take a little longer to work and to figure it out. But that's what it's all about what is the root cause? And you've been saying that this entire interview, so I really, really appreciate that.
Yeah, it is so true.
You mentioned some vets, of course, um, you know, we can't see eye to eye with the treatment that we're gonna give our dog. So sometimes not only veterinarians, but others in our life, and our dog's life, are judging us on the choices that we make. So what are your thoughts about dealing with judgment from others?
How to Deal With Judgement From Others
you know, judgment is so real. And this journey for me has been not only about realizing how to deal with judgment of me and my dog, but also looking at myself and realizing that I need to look at other people and their dogs without judgment. You know, there's no two people that are going to have the same combination of a conventional or natural approach to medical or behavioral issues. And there's no best way. So I think, you know, as a person, as human beings, if we just stop judging others worry less about other people and how they do it, and not seeing someone doing it differently than me as a put down as my way of doing it instead of celebrating that we are all finding the right balance for us, and our pets. And it's a special journey between you and your dog. Because you're growing together and finding this beautiful combination that works for you. And it's easy to say and you know, I do I should point out that when you have a dog, especially a reactive dog, it's a whole journey of judgment, because I can remember earlier years when I would cry on a walk, like he would have a huge outburst and I would be holding him with all my strength. And the owner would be looking at me with really big eyes, you know, half wondering if they're about to be eaten and the other half thinking get control lady. Sure. And that was really hard for me. And I've made so much progress that now when my dog has a fail, for the most part on good days, I can be like, Hey, buddy, it's okay. You know, I’ve got this and you're okay and having this more. Like, I see you're upset. I'm here, and I'm going to get in front of You and I'm going to stop your behavior. But I'm going to calm you I'm not going to go, Oh, my goodness, this is so embarrassing. It's a real, it's a different mental place for me.
Or punishment. You’re not going to punish them for how they're feeling and reacting.
Exactly. And you know, I have a story that illustrates how perceived judgment can affect you, you know, I've made this progress with Tico. And we can now go, there's a certain lake where we can walk on the trail with a lot of other people and dogs and bikes. But it has this beautiful grassy expanse next to the trail. So I can always veer as wide as I need to, to keep him in a calm state. And we were walking there. And in this training that I've done in the last year, he has responded, and he was walking by my side with a loose leash. And as we approached, a couple was approaching us and the man stopped talking to his wife, and he watched. And as I came close, he smiled at me, and he pointed at Tico, my sweet little psychotic nightmare of a dog. And he said, Now, that is a well trained dog. And I tell you, I still tell the story. And I choke up because I thought, for so many years, every comment, every reaction I got about this dog, obviously affected me more than I have wanted to let on because I'm like, refocus, you know, this is just about Tico, and we can do this. But to hear that, and to have that emotional reaction. You know, dealing with judgment is hard as a pet owner. So I think it's a constant journey to gain the confidence in what you're doing, to be able to separate yourself from that judgment and find your confidence in your relationship with your dog.
Oh, you said it's so well, perfect. Well, as we are wrapping up, Karen, what are your final thoughts on this topic? What advice would you give to others that are listening that are having these same struggles?
You know, I think I would just want to remind them that, you know, we all have to constantly work, and I have to constantly work to remind myself that my balance of natural versus conventional ownership for my dogs is okay. And it's about finding what works for us, not about the right way or the wrong way. And when I have that mindset, I really, truly believe that my dogs are happier. I'm happier, I'm more comfortable with my choices. That makes me happier and less stressed pet owner, and it's just this is a positive spiral. Because my dog will sense that I'm happy. And they're happier. And we just keep feeling better and better about our choices. But it's okay, that it's a struggle. I think we all need to give ourselves a little grace, and know that it's about the journey and about the growth.
Well said, well, Karen, you, as you mentioned, you are a blogger, and have chosen this path of being a natural pet blogger, what do you want to offer to our listeners as far as finding you? And how can they make suggestions on topics like these that they would love to see you cover in your blog?
You know, I would just say the blog is HappyNaturalDog.com all one word. So come on over to HappyNaturalDog.com And if you don't see something that you're looking for, maybe something you've discovered, message me, there's a Contact Me button, you can email me at happynaturaldog@gmail.com. And those are my favorite topics to write about. Because there's just a gratification in being able to help another owner who's on a journey like I have been. And it's also empowering for me because I love to learn about things. And I always end up learning new things about natural healthcare. When I'm answering a question and helping someone look for options.
Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/happynaturaldog
LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/karenkpedersen/
Yeah, I am the same way. It's all about education and sharing this information. Because we all when it comes down to it. We're all like minded, we're all in community, and need to help push each other forward. So I love what you're doing. I just, I thank you for sharing this with us today. The stories I think are what people react to and can put your put themselves in your shoes. And I know that we've helped a lot of people today. So I just am so grateful for everything that you do. Thank you, Karen.
Well, thank you and thank you for doing this podcast because this is the way that people find others or find ideas and it's just invaluable to have something like this that people can find and learn on.
Well. It's just Another platform and we have to all keep moving the needle forward and helping each other out. So thank you. And we will be back next time with another informative Wag Out Loud episode. And everything that we talked about today. All the links, how to get a hold of Karen is all going to be in the show notes. So thank you everybody for being the best advocate for your dogs.
I want to again thank the team at Green and Experience for not only being our monthly sponsor, but for also creating the amazing plant-based fetch ball, a safe and natural toy that I feel good about giving to my dog Winston. Check out their online store by going to Etsy.com and put GreenandExperience in the search bar. You can also find the direct link in the show notes. Choose from a set of two or three fetch balls and save by using the code WOL15 at checkout for a 15% discount. Also, if you purchase two or more fetch balls and yours is one of the first 100 orders, you will also receive a FREE encapsulated dog tag valued at $15.
Thanks for listening. You'll find some helpful links in the show notes and if you enjoy the show, please be sure to follow and listen for free on your favorite podcast app. And please, please share your feedback. Visit WagOutLoud.com for great product recommendations with discounts, amazing online events and fantastic resources. That's also where to visit our Bark About It page where you can suggest topics, guests or products. Be advised that this show offers health and nutritional information and is designed for educational purposes only. You're encouraged to do your own research and should not rely on this information as a substitute for nor does it replace professional medical advice, diagnosis or treatment. If you have any concerns or questions about your dog's health, you should always consult a veterinarian or a nutrition expert. Have a tail wagging day and we'll catch you next time.
Hey Winston was that another tail wagging episode?
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